Another bootleg download site.

[will.15]

One advantage for film buffs for a movie being in the public domain, you can find it. There are a lot of movies that are not lost films, but are hard to come by because they've never been released in a video format.

[Steve Crook]

name='robotoid97' date='06 July 2010 - 10:46 PM' timestamp='1278452770' post='448668']

Hi Steve - thank you for the reply and I did not realize there was such a difference between European and US copyright & what is legally a public domain film.



All the film titles on the list I looked at on the website linked above were PD films in the US and there are not just ebay/ioffer sellers selling them but also many US DVD companies such as Mill Creek, Infinity, Alpha, Millennium, etc, selling them individually or in box sets from their company sites as well as Best Buy, Amazon, etc...



Just curious were there any film titles that you noticed on the website that were PD in the US but no so in the UK or Europe?



Also if a Brit or European purchased a Mill Creek or Infinity set from the company and it turned out one of the titles was PD in the US but not in Europe or the UK would the buyer get in trouble or would the company be at fault even if the DVD was region 1 intended for US sales only?

But how can you tell that the film is in public domain? Can you trust the seller? How well do you know them? How reputable are they? A lot of individual web sites offer titles claiming that they are in the public domain when they aren't. There is no general list or database where you can look up the copyright status of an individual title.



There have been many cases that I've seen over the years where a title is legally in the public domain in the US but is still in copyright in the rest of the world. Many have been mentioned on this site.



If I was to buy something from an American site that was public domain in the US then that's quite legal. The copyright law that applies is the one in force in the country where it's being sold, not the one where it's being bought. But if I bought one where it was claimed that it was in the public domain when it wasn't then the seller could get into trouble wherever the buyer happens to live.



The region restrictions on DVDs are of dubious legality. They're intended as a restraint on free trade and all the countries involved have signed the GATT and other free trade agreements. There should be no general restrictions on me buying anything in the States or on you buying anything from over here. As it happens I often buy DVDs from the States. My DVD player can play any DVDs even if they have the region restrictions on them. My player just ignores those. And all video & DVD players sold here in the last 10 years or so can play anything in NTSC format so that's no restriction either.



However, if an individual seller in any country decides that they don't want to sell things to other countries, that's quite all right. It's their prerogative if they want to restrict their own market.



Steve

[Steve Crook]

name='will.15' date='06 July 2010 - 10:59 PM' timestamp='1278453560' post='448671']

One advantage for film buffs for a movie being in the public domain, you can find it. There are a lot of movies that are not lost films, but are hard to come by because they've never been released in a video format.

There are quite a lot of cases where the copyright owners have never released a title on video or DVD mainly because of the lax laws about copyright in the States. They know that once their title gets classified as being in the public domain they can never get control over it again.



There are many other cases where copyright owners have never released their titles is because of the number of illegal copies being sold or shared.



It's good for the film buff that so many titles are available, but it can also make some copyright holders wary of releasing the titles they hold



It's a delicate balance



Steve

[robotoid97]

name='didi-5' date='06 July 2010 - 04:35 PM' timestamp='1278448519' post='448632']

$99 for a Mill Creek set?!



They're worth maybe $20 at most. Terrible prints in the main but perhaps the only way of seeing some stuff. I bought a few because they had episodes of Studio One (classic 1950s TV).



Edit: just realized you're talking about their massive sets. I only have the 50 film ones for musicals, dark crimes, and historic classics.

You're right the quality is so-so on many of their titles but I'd watch some of their rarer offerings in any quality. I noticed there are quite a few made for TV films in their assorted box sets which is always a plus as they seldom turn up and are hard to find.



They are a good source of movies for entry level collectors or people who want an instant film library as they give you a lot for very little money, the down side of coarse is the quality of some of the prints.

[robotoid97]

name='Steve Crook' date='06 July 2010 - 07:12 PM' timestamp='1278457978' post='448692']

But how can you tell that the film is in public domain? Can you trust the seller? How well do you know them? How reputable are they? A lot of individual web sites offer titles claiming that they are in the public domain when they aren't. There is no general list or database where you can look up the copyright status of an individual title.



Steve

That's very true, it's often tough to tell what's legitimate with all the sellers on line and elsewhere making all sorts of claims and more than likely you can only estimate on some of the more obscure titles.



I suppose at the end of it all a person can do is look at all the peripheral evidence surrounding a particular film ie; 1) See how many years a title has been floating around unchallenged as a PD film in one form or another VHS, DVD, etc and see if there was ever any litigation for ownership. 2) See if the particular title was ever released as PD from a major company of some type as they tend not to take legal risks 3) If in the US you can also check the Library of Congress archive.

[Steve Crook]

name='robotoid97' date='07 July 2010 - 02:21 AM' timestamp='1278465678' post='448709']

3) If in the US you can also check the Library of Congress archive.

Where is it recorded in the Library of Congress archive? I often use that, usually when looking up books, but I often come across references to films and I have never noticed their copyright status.



BTW Why do you always put your posts in bold? Why not just leave it for emphasis?



Steve

[robotoid97]

name='Steve Crook' date='06 July 2010 - 10:11 PM' timestamp='1278468705' post='448714']

Where is it recorded in the Library of Congress archive? I often use that, usually when looking up books, but I often come across references to films and I have never noticed their copyright status.



BTW Why do you always put your posts in bold? Why not just leave it for emphasis?



Steve

Hi Steve - The copyright information (if present) is located on the full record tab in the "notes" section, there is also the Public catalog search from 1978 - present on-line (please see link below)



Public catalog



PS; It's force of habit due to my vision as I find the thicker letters in bold easier for me to proof read when posting a reply, the old peepers are not what they use to be. no offense meant and I'll be happy to stop.

[will.15]

There is a book in the local public library that lists movies whose copyrights weren't renewed up to a certain year.





I was lookung at some sites listing public domain movies. Most looked right, but there was one listing a number of movies i know are not in the public domain in the United States. Dr. Strangelove is not in the public domain.



On a more legitimate site I came across a movie categorized as film noir I never heard of starring Lionel Atwill as an insurance investigator, The Wrong Road (1936). More like semi film noir, but it was a good little movie and great seeing Atwill play a good guy for once and it was an excellent print.

[robotoid97]

name='will.15' date='06 July 2010 - 11:24 PM' timestamp='1278473048' post='448718']

On a more legitimate site I came across a movie categorized as film noir I never heard of starring Lionel Atwill as an insurance investigator, The Wrong Road (1936). More like semi film noir, but it was a good little movie and great seeing Atwill play a good guy for once and it was an excellent print.

Will - sounds like an interesting film I'll have to check out as Atwill always gives a good performance and is certainly worth a look.

[Steve Crook]

name='robotoid97' date='07 July 2010 - 04:20 AM' timestamp='1278472807' post='448717']

Hi Steve - The copyright information (if present) is located on the full record tab in the "notes" section, there is also the Public catalog search from 1978 - present on-line (please see link below)



Public catalog

Great, thanks. I'll bookmark that as well as the search I usually use there

PS; It's force of habit due to my vision as I find the thicker letters in bold easier for me to proof read when posting a reply, the old peepers are not what they use to be. no offense meant and I'll be happy to stop.

It's not offensive. I just think it's best to save things like bold or italics for added emphasis when you really want to stress something



If you use Firefox then you can make any web page appear in larger (or smaller) print

I think that Internet Exploder copied this feature into their latest browser



Steve

[will.15]

By the way, there are other ways a film in the US can fall into the public domain under the pre 1978 revisions other than failing to file for copyright renewal. This is why Night of the Living Dead fell into the public domain, from Wikipedia:



Copyright status

Night of the Living Dead lapsed into the public domain because the original theatrical distributor, the Walter Reade Organization, neglected to place a copyright indication on the prints. In 1968, United States copyright law required a proper notice for a work to maintain a copyright.[120] Image Ten displayed such a notice on the title frames of the film beneath the original title, Night of the Flesh Eaters. The distributor removed the statement when it changed the title.[121] According to George Romero, Walter Reade "ripped us off".[122]



Because of the public domain status, the film is sold on home video by several distributors. As of 2006, the Internet Movie Database lists 23 copies of Night of the Living Dead retailing on DVD and nineteen on VHS.[123] The original film is available to view or download free on Internet sites such as Google Video, Internet Archive and YouTube.[124][125][126] As of May 22, 2010, it was the Internet Archive's second most downloaded film, with 680,923 downloads