hhhhancock

I am alarmed at the number of old British films being sold on Ebay purporting to be in the public domain. There are many films listed that I would like but I will not buy them because their sale is ultimately damaging to our film industry.

I have reported this to Ebay on 2 occasions by email with, perhaps inevitably, no response. More surprisingly I have emailed the Federation Against Copyright Theft (FACT) 3 times and again received no reply, not even the courtesy of an acknowledgement.

Is there anything we can do to get Ebay and FACT to take notice of what is actually tantamount to theft? Besides not buying them of course which doesn't completely solve the problem.

Hugo

Who exactly is being damaged here ?

I can understand the concern of the film industry regarding pirate copies of new and recent blockbusters which dent their profits. But providing 'public domain' copies of old British films of the thirties and forties, for private use, is surely doing a service to film enthusiasts such as the people who contribute to this website. The alternative is that very few of these films would be available to film buffs at all.

earlb

There is no such thing as 'Public Domain', they're all copyrighted somewhere or with someone. Having said that, I think the Film Companies deserve their product to be pirated for witholding them. If they don't want to reap the rewards, let somebody else.

I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.

Grey Wyler

During the 1980's i remember the roaring trade in duped Doctor Who videos at Sci - fi conventions and comic fairs. 9 times out of 10, bad, barely watchable quality and high, high prices.

BBC start to release the show legally on Video. Bootleg trade begins to die. Now with so much available on Disc and tape, there is little or no illegal Doctor Who trade at all.

So the moral is if the companies that own the material make it available, then obviously the DVD -R trade will fade away.

Until then, if someone is making a decent copy of a 40's or 50's movie that is unavailable any other way; well its hardly a capital crime.

hhhhancock

My problem is with many of these films that are already legitimately on the market by the copyright holders, I've recently seen Genevieve, The Huggetts collection, Will Hay & George Formby movies, even Norman Wisdom films for sale as PD movies.
I do tend to agree with you about the rarer and more obscure titles though, these films may never be released to DVD so it's the one opportunity us enthusiasts have to get hold of them. Regards.

batman

We have had this debate several times and the answer is that it is up to one's own judgement if you buy bootlegs of titles that are available legitimately. Personally I would rather have a good copy of a film than a dvdr transfer of dubious quality. With regard to films unavailable elsewhere .... get them where you can because, as hhhhancock says, you may never see the many where else.

I'm the cutest bottom judge!

DB7

I wouldn't portray them as noble and doing a service. For example take this guy:
eBay UK Shop - BritFilm: 1950's, Drama, Comedy

Around the £8-10 mark, plus £3 postage. For example, his copy of What a Carve Up is four quid dearer than Play.com's legit one. It's probably a cheap disk and a run off from Movies4Men.

kelp

Ebay are really only interested in making cash; anything else in their world "Does not require action...does not compute". As for the Federation, too toothless to be of any use at all, apart from making ad's telling the people not to commit crime. Sorry, but they are just like the Trading Standards Office, slow and far too busy to deal with the problems at hand.
My God, I do sound depressed.......So, one has to use ones own judgement I'm afraid.

BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR...YOU MAY GET IT!

davidb

this ties in with the "films that should be on dvd but arent " thread .if whoever owns the copyright are too lazy to release an old film that theres obviously demand to see and the ebay seller has done a good copy for a reasonable price ,i dont have a problem with it . the only form of bootlegging i would have issue with is new releases that are still on at the cinema .

Steve Crook

What about the consideration that bootlegs reduce the chances of a legitimate release? You call the copyright holders lazy. They aren't. But they must convince the publisher and distributor that there will be a chance of at least recouping most of their money after laying out for the costs of getting the DVD made, covers printed, advertised etc.

If everyone has a bootleg copy of a title then the copyright holders know that they won't sell anywhere near as many.

Steve

vetchbook

I agree with some aspects of what has been said but find it annoying that some people on Ebay say film is in the public domain when we all know that it clearly is not.
what next?

batman

Have a look at these two ....

IT ALWAYS RAINS ON SUNDAY....starring Betty Ann Davies on eBay, also, DVDs, DVD, Film TV (end time 09-Jul-08 18:23:59 BST)

Amazon.co.uk: It Always Rains On Sunday [1947]:...

I know which one I would rather have .... but from the same seller you can get ....

WOMAN IN A DRESSING GOWN on eBay, also, DVDs, DVD, Film TV (end time 12-Jul-08 18:21:21 BST)

.... which isn't available 'officially'.

I'm the cutest bottom judge!

Steve Crook

The people selling films on eBay that claim they are public domain are often Americans who just know no better. They are public domain in the States. They don't know about the different copyright rules in different countries

Steve

batman

I agree again!

However, the seller in my previous post is based in Yorkshire. I bought WIADG from him because I have never seen it and there were no official copies available. Purchases of this title may hamper the chances of a legit release but what can you do except use your own judgement.

I'm the cutest bottom judge!

Wee Sonny MacGregor

This notion that "copyright has not been applied for" is a novel concept! Anyway, the US case brought against ebay last week by Dior & Louis Vuitton highlighted the fact that there are 10m items for sale on ebay at any one time and it would be impossible to police them all. Still, the apparent success of those two companies could encourage others to enforce what they consider are their legal rights.