Scrooge- Sir Seymour Hicks

[dpgmel]

name='CaptainWaggett']Cheers. It shall be mine!

....and mine

[John Hodson]

Looks like E1 Entertainment have acquired the UK rights to a number of PD films crayoned in by US company Legend and this is just of a batch; expect the transfer to be the same - there's a trailer for the ghastly 'colorized' version here.



BTW, it's also in [ame="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Classic-Christmas-Collection-Digitally-remastered/dp/B002DFE09M/ref=sr_1_33?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1252057563&sr=1-33"]this box set[/ame].

[JamesM]

The copy being sold on Amazon is a bootleg. I see they are also selling the same company's colourized version of Things To Come, which is also a bootleg.

[JamesM]

Shall we invite E1 Entertainment on here and ask them why they are not just colourizing films but selling bootlegs?

[John Hodson]

name='JamesM']Shall we invite E1 Entertainment on here and ask them why they are not just colourizing films but selling bootlegs?

Presumably for the same reason that Legend are selling them; money.



It may well be also that, Legend having done the crayoning in, these may be simply NTSC transfers, or shoddy NTSC/PAL conversion - caveat emptor. The films also include the usual suspects where rights issues are, shall we say, at best in dispute, at worst, totally ignored - a couple of Rathbone Holmes films, A&C's Africa Screams, etc. etc.



Particularly in the case of Things to Come, you would have thought that ITV Global would have stepped in and put a stop to that one wouldn't you (and it's a very, very poor effort if the Legend disc is anything to go by in any case - far better to plump for the superb, properly licensed, and unmolested colour wise, Network release)

[Steve Crook]

name='JamesM']Shall we invite E1 Entertainment on here and ask them why they are not just colourizing films but selling bootlegs?

Not everyone's as fine and upstanding a citizen as the members of the BritMovie community



Steve

[JamesM]

I think what may have happened here is that Legend Films told E1 Entertainment that they owned the copyright outright on their colourized versions, which would be true for the US public domain films they colourized but not for the titles that were in copyright (Scrooge and Things To Come). E1 have listed these two titles in good faith. They are aware now so they should not risk attempting to sell two these films now.



There's something about Scrooge. BBC and Warner started selling a bootleg of the 1951 version before withdrawing all sales before release date. BBC Worldwide had believed that the film was in the public domain (impossible for any British feature film made in 1951).

[JamesM]

Africa Screams and four of the Rathbone Holmes films are in the public domain in the US and, as they are US films they are also in the public domain in the UK as we apply the shorter term rule.



All the US films Legend have put out are in the public domain. They probably believed that these two British films were in the public domain in the US before they colourized them. They should know now though that they are not but should have always known that they would not necessarily be in the public domain in the UK.



I notice that all the E1 titles from Legend are listed as 'not available' (unlike normal pre-order titles) on Amazon. There are only four titles that should be affected. These are the two films mentioned above and the sets they appear in. One is mentioned above but I notice that Things To Come is also sold as part of a three film set called "The Ray Harryhausen Collection". All three films were made whilst Ray was a child.



[ame=http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ray-Harryhausen-Collection-Dangerous-Things/dp/B002DFE0CY]Ray Harryhausen Collection Dangerous, She, Things DVD 1932: Amazon.co.uk: Leslie Banks, Raymond Massey, Cedric Hardwicke, Helen Gahagan, Randolph Scott, Helen Mack, Nigel Bruce, Gustav Von Wangenheim, Samuel S. Hinds, Noble Johnson, Joel McCrea, Fay [/ame]

[oldfilmfan]

I have a copy of the 9.5mm sound version distributed by Pathescope pre war. They always re edited the films slightly to keep the prices down. Also have a longer version on VHS from TV. This appears to be the full length. To my mind this 1935 version really captures the atmosphere of the Dickens novel and is my favourite version. Sir Seymour Hicks portrays Scrooge really well. Possibly better than the Alistair Sim version. What a pity the latest issue is colourised.

[Nick Cooper]

There seems to be some dispute whether Things to Come is actually PD in the United States, or whether it's copyright was reinstated under GATT as that of Metropolis was. Whilst working on the Network release I never managed to find conclusive evidence one way or the other, but it may be that even if the copyright could be enforced in the US, the sheer proliferation of "PD" releases on VHS and DVD would make it an uphill struggle. Stable doors and horses, etc.



As to the E1 release, I was unaware that it existed until a couple of weeks ago, as were Network when I informed them, who in turn passed it on to ITV Global. E1 Entertainment were formerly the Contender Group, and one would think that they would have known better. A quick check of the BBFC database would have shown the relatively recent releases by DDHE and Network, which one would think would have prompted some investigation by E1 as to the ownership of the film.



It should be noted, of course, that the print used by Legend Films is not only in a very poor condition - for all their "digital re-mastering" claims - but it is also not complete. This is not just a question of it not having the four additional segments of footage that were reinstated for the Network DVD to bring it up to the original American release length of 96m 24s, as there are cuts elsewhere (e.g. in the opening Christmas Eve montage) with the effect that it actually runs to about a minute shorter than the "standard" 92m 42s print (89m in PAL).

[John Hodson]

In the States the Golan Decision has muddied the waters considerably copyright wise; over here there should be no doubts - but why bother with anything other than the Network edition when it's available for as little as £7.43?



Oh, and hi Nick!