batman

I would agree with that. Also, not many people seem to want to use drugs (including alcohol) to 'chill out' and get 'mellow' anymore.

Bats.

Daddy .... the frisbee has gone in the water .... what a finger puppet drama queen I am!

David Brent

There's not much call for a Lada in Wimbledon.

Dave.

David Brent

Maybe Iran is the place to move to.
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad made a speech recently confirming that his country does not have any criminals, terrorists or homosexuals.

Of course, they do not have any human rights either.

Dave.

Fareham_Bee

The debate about whether things are worse or much the same as the past is going from a goody to one of my dad's bigger than your dad.

So I'll join in LOL!

I left my car parked outside the pub I worked in in Shepherds Bush, Steve. One night. I found it with both side windows smashed, the radio and graphic equalizer gone. These were both bolted in from the back, we'd taken a long time installing and wanted to make life difficult to any potential thieves. They were covered with a black plastic thing that made it look like a dash with no radio. To get them out they liiterally had to pull out most of the dash, including speedo display bit, so they did. All for twenty quid in a pub next night.

The next night (with new front windows) the back screen was done to get at a couple of cheap speakers. This was parked outside my tower block in Brentford. We can all relate stories about how crime free/ridden areas or times were or are. You were lucky, I wasn't.

I do leave my car unlocked outside my house regularly, not intentionally I just forget (NO AGE JOKES PLEASE )I have even left the house unlocked during the day. I have been lucky, the house opposite was done twice in a few weeks.

Crime, petty and violent, drugs etc have always been with us but they seem more prevelant nowadays. We can all call on examples and it's certainly easier to call on more recent ones as they are fresher in the memory. But when we were kids we got kicks from knocking on doors and running away, maybe a ruck with the local estate that turned out to be more posing than anything, but the search for kicks seems to have gotten further to show more and more bravado. This hideous thing of "happy slapping", or gangs attacking complete strangers "just because", they are happening more and more. "Steaming" on trains and buses, relatively new little game over the last fifteen/twenty years.

Take the family in Rotherham who came home last week to find the pet rabbits dead and part of them pushed through the letterbox and smeared over the car. WHY FFS? What kicks can you possibly get out of that? It just seems mindless now.

Some of the violence like Dunblane, the IRA attacks etc can be explained that the perpetrators saw themselves (rightly or wrongly) as freedom fighters. Right thinking people just saw them as terrorists, the same way most of us see Bush and Blair nowadays.

As I said earlier, it's not what is true that counts, it what appears to be true that makes people think the way they do.

Moor Larkin

No I'm not.

Steve Crook

This is nothing to do with the size of our respective parents. What it is to do with is about the difference between reality and the perception of that reality.

Nobody denies that crimes happen and that it's always terrible when it does, especially for those involved. What I take issue with is the idea that it's so much worse now and that it was always so much better in some "golden age" in the past.

It is a matter of degree and a matter of perception of course. I would say that when I left my car unlocked and it wasn't broken in to or stolen, that is the norm and you were unlucky when it happened to you. There are some parts of London and other cities where, had I left the car unlocked, I wouldn't be surprised if the radio was stolen.

But I maintain that those that carry out criminal acts are in the minority and that the vast majority of the groups of teenagers (hooded or not) are quite normal, friendly, good people and quite harmless. Also that it's quite easy to live in fear, whether that fear is generated by untrue or exaggerated stories in the newspapers or just rumours heard down the pub. Undoubtedly many of these stories start off as a real event but they are then exaggerated beyond recognition and they are taken to be the norm. But if you strive to find out the truth behind each story rather than just accepting them, you will often find that things are nowhere near as bad as the stories would have you believe.

It is possible, quite easy even, to believe the worst in every situation and think that the sky is falling in. I choose not to.

Steve

Steve Crook

I'll ignore that

Steve

Moor Larkin

There is always a tendency to have Ghetto's. I can recall my brand new Sixties 'Council Estate' being a jolly nice place when I was a kid. It developed a terrible reputation over the next twenty years and was eventually visited by Michael Heseltine, when he was trouble-shooting for Maggie..... thatwas a big help.

I walked my small child, in a buggy, around the estate, one time on a nostalgic ramble, half-expecting to see glue-sniffers (very much the fashion at the time) on every street corner........ but it looked much the same as when I was young - except there were cars parked nose to tail on every spare scrap of tarmac. Nobody had expected 'poor' people to ever be able to buy a motor-car when the estate had been built.

As other Posters have said, Narcotic drugs do seem to have a particular evil of their own, over and above alcohol - but I don't think they are in any way unique to Britain.

It seems to me that many of the problems in this global world derive from emigres poking at the countries they have left; whether it be Scottish movie stars or Saudi rich-kids.

christoph404

Yes I agree, young people today are not using drugs or alchohol in an experimental or enlighteneing way, as you say,its to get as smashed as quickly as possible and blur the harsh reality of their situation, ie, out of work, no money, no prospects, and that I would say is something that is a modern phenomenon. As I said, I think much of the crime today can be traced back to a connection with drugs,and the drugs of the day are Heroin and Cocaine, whether it is young people shooting each other over drug trading territory or whatever, or burglary and shoplifting by youngsters who have become addicts and are desperate to feed their habit. Certainly the recent news stories concerning teenagers being shot dead in south London council estates is drug related. On television last night I watched a documentary about shoplifters and methods employed to catch them. In Dundee in Scotland a hardened plain clothes police officer with more than 25 years in the force, while arresting a teenage heroin addict for shoplifting said that drug addiction has become the main factor in driving people to commit this type of crime and that the young lad he arrested would not be stealing DVDs from Virgin if he did not have a drug habit to feed. It seems like an epidemic of a terrible disease that is spreading to every corner of the UK, I really do think that is the difference between now and the 50s and 60s or even 70s. When I was at school in the 70s the drug problem was practically non existent, now when I visit my home town I can see that every one has become very security conscious, locking all their doors etc, it never used to be like that, now their is a drug problem amongst the unemployed young people and with that comes an increase in burglary and theft and personnal assault and robbery.

DB7

I read a piece on Croxteth and the Rhys murder recently and apparently youth unemployment nears 40% (I recall Andrew Marr having it even higher when reflecting on the 80s riots) and youth workers describe a teenage nihilism. I don't condone it but drugs and crime must be a tempting avenue to earn easy money.

christoph404

...I must say Moor, thats the daftest thing I've ever heard! you are obviously joking?....

BristolUK

Yes the official ones are. Those are the genuine ones doing something about their situation, as opposed to those simply raising cash for their next fix.

Being a trusting sort of bloke, though, checking for people's ID when I'm out and about is not something I do.

It's only when they say (or do) something that doesn't ring true and then is when doubt comes in and I see the lack of ID displayed.

foha80

I grew up in the eastend of Glasgow in the 50's & 60's,I lived in a tenement that had outside shared toilets,there wasn't any baths if you wanted hot water you boiled a kettle.As I grew up I learned the names of aunt's and uncles who died young of TB and other common diseases.

I also learned the name of a sister who died in infancy this was common to many families at that time.When I came along my mother embraced powder milk,she knew only too well the problems of maintaining a healthy diet while breast feeding.We had the 11+ -a small percentage were sent on to grammar schools the rest of us went off to junior secondaries,going to university never occured to me it was just not an option

At 15 I left school and my mother got me started work in a local factory,I remember the woman and children waiting outside the factory on a friday afternoon so they could get their husbands wages.In ther 60's they bulldozed a lot of the tenement slums and replaced them with large council estates devoid of shops or amenities,Teenage gangs sprung up many taking their names from the Glasgow 'razor' gangs of the 30's.

This year my daughter graduated from university I along with my wife the rest of the family attended the conferrment it was a proud day for us all.I don't know what the future will bring for my daughter but I do know that she will be able to choose to breast feed her children, if she wishes to take credit she won't have to get a man to sign the hire purchase agreement and she won't have to depend on anyone to 'keep' her.

Back in the 5o's & 60's there were many good things but there was a lot of bad things as well.I know this is a personal reflection but for me the benefits of todays society far outweigh the disadvantages.

Terry

Moor Larkin

Yes I agree, young people today are not using drugs or alchohol in an experimental or enlighteneing way



BBC NEWS | Scotland | Connery's independence hope

The Discreet Charm of the Terrorist Cause

christoph404

you realise of course I was simply agreeing with Steve Crooks enlightening statement!

I don't think Connery is particularly critical of the UK or is contributing to problems of unrest etc here in Britain, I think he just has an aversion to Scotlands continued union with England!!....