Raoul Moat

[Timmy_Lea]

name='DB7' date='12 July 2010 - 10:56 PM' timestamp='1278971776' post='451047']

Not really, his death has just thrown up more questions than answers.

Questions are fine, but people adding 2 + 2 together to make 5 is unpalatable.

[bruiser15]

Unpalatable, Steroids are brought into the discussion and as I stated that was one of my first thoughts, and having seen first hand the murderous anger they can cause I just put out information which I know about, I also said it would never be known what caused this dreadful incident, but all possibilities should be considered. That is what is involved in a discussion, already his mental health and upbringing have been mentioned as possible contributing factors and as far as I know nobody has any hard and fast facts to back these up.



Dont worry I will not be contributing again. I have learned to keep my opinions to myself from now on.

[Onedin]

Could we please stay focussed, folks?

[Kitty Whiskers]

name='Timmy_Lea' date='12 July 2010 - 09:41 PM' timestamp='1278970900' post='451042']

Brilliant, just what we need. More conjecture from the general public with little evidence!



I guess that's what happens when an event like this gets total media saturation. Everyone's got an opinion. . .

I understand your feelings, but it's natural for people to wonder out loud what makes an ordinary person turn into the type of person that does horrible things. It's the way we try to make sense of the awfulness.

[ShirlGirl]

name='bruiser15' date='12 July 2010 - 11:39 PM' timestamp='1278974371' post='451053']

Well pardon me for having an opinion about something I know about. The Steroid Abuse that is. I am not the first on this thread to have an opinion about the whole matter, and yet whilst trying to give some extra info i'm chastized for it, funny but I thought we were all the general public here. If you think he got the shape he was without Steroids more power to your elbow.



I'm going back to the quiz section and stop having any opinions at all

I, for one, did not react to your post the way Timmy_Lea did, bruiser, no reason for you to be chastized at all. I thought your opinion was very valid, especially, as you have said, steriod abuse is something you know about.

[Ray]

name='bruiser15' date='12 July 2010 - 11:39 PM' timestamp='1278974371' post='451053']

Well pardon me for having an opinion about something I know about. The Steroid Abuse that is. I am not the first on this thread to have an opinion about the whole matter, and yet whilst trying to give some extra info i'm chastized for it, funny but I thought we were all the general public here. If you think he got the shape he was without Steroids more power to your elbow.



I'm going back to the quiz section and stop having any opinions at all

Ignore him! you make a lot of sense to me. I got the same reaction from him when I dared to voice my opinion.

[zettel45]

name='Timmy_Lea' date='12 July 2010 - 11:40 PM' timestamp='1278974432' post='451054']Questions are fine, but people adding 2 + 2 together to make 5 is unpalatable.

I don't think that's what Bruiser did, though, Tim. He simply raised the possibility that steroid abuse might've been a factor in Moat's behavior, and was careful to admit that we can't know for sure.



It would of course be wrong to reduce a complex psychological problem to a single, convenient factor (steroids, video games, violent films, pornography, the internet, the new series of "My Family", etc, etc), and this is something the media does with depressing regularity. But unless I'm mistaking him that wasn't what Bruiser was suggesting. He raised "roid rage" as something to "bear in mind". Personally, I thought that was an entirely fair point.

[wellendcanons]

name='bruiser15' date='12 July 2010 - 11:52 PM' timestamp='1278975175' post='451056']

Unpalatable, Steroids are brought into the discussion and as I stated that was one of my first thoughts, and having seen first hand the murderous anger they can cause I just put out information which I know about, I also said it would never be known what caused this dreadful incident, but all possibilities should be considered. That is what is involved in a discussion, already his mental health and upbringing have been mentioned as possible contributing factors and as far as I know nobody has any hard and fast facts to back these up.



Dont worry I will not be contributing again. I have learned to keep my opinions to myself from now on.

I found your contribution very valid to the discussion on here bruiser, so plesae don't be put off from further discussions. You did state that all possibilites should be considered so you weren't even committing yourself. I certainly was grateful for your contribution.



wellendcanons.

[faginsgirl]

name='bruiser15' date='12 July 2010 - 11:52 PM' timestamp='1278975175' post='451056']





Dont worry I will not be contributing again. I have learned to keep my opinions to myself from now on.

That`s a shame



xx

[jimw1]

Taser officers were 'trying to stop Raoul Moat committing suicide'





Two police officers fired Taser guns at Raoul Moat around the time he shot himself, an inquest opening heard today.



Police deployed the weapons in an attempt to stop Moat killing himself, the hearing was told.







It is not clear whether the Tasers were fired before or after Moat turned his gun on himself, Independent Police Complaints Commission investigator Steve Reynolds told the hearing in Newcastle.



Mr Reynolds, a senior investigator with the IPCC, told the hearing at Newcastle Civic Centre: "At 1.12am Mr Moat's shotgun discharged, resulting in him receiving fatal injuries.



"At some point around the time of the fatal shot two West Yorkshire firearms officers armed with Tasers discharged their weapons at Mr Moat.



"This was understood to have been in an effort to prevent Mr Moat taking his own life.



"At this stage the precise sequence of events regarding the discharge of Taser has not been established and is under investigation."

[Onedin]

I had to look up the translation of the word 'Unpalatable' in the first place.........





This is something that shook a whole nation, that's for sure. All of you obviously have to deal with this, that much is clear. Thing is, with dramatic things like this, people might get divided in their opinions, thoughts and feelings. But you don't always have to agree with others, do you.............. some of you agree to disagree.





There are so very many sides to this drama.......... people died and three children were sentenced to life. That is quite something. This was terrible in so very many ways there is hardly an end to the 'list', so to speak.







What I'm basically saying in connection to this thread (or any thread for that matter)......... it's ok for people to disagree. It's just that 'nuance' and 'respect' are two words that spring to mind, that's all.

[Marky B]

ITV News North East has just played tape recordings of Moat starting from last year.

Ta Ta

Marky B

[penfold]

For the record, Bruiser didn't bring up the subject of Moat's possible steroid abuse, I did; and while Timmy Lea may describe it as conjecture, I would describe it as an educated guess. I do have a fair idea of what I talk about.

From today's Independent.

"The inquest into gunman Raoul Moat's death is due to open today as the mother of the man he murdered criticised police for failing to protect her son.



Chris Brown's mother said officers should have warned the 29-year-old karate instructor they had received intelligence from Durham Prison suggesting his life was in danger.



Moat, a steroid-addicted former nightclub doorman, was released from prison on July 1 after serving a short sentence for assault."

[DB7]

name='jimw1' date='13 July 2010 - 04:20 PM' timestamp='1279034445' post='451391']





Taser officers were 'trying to stop Raoul Moat committing suicide'

I looked at a YT clip of a guy hit by the shotgun taser - and unsurprisingly his hand clenches when hit.

name='Marky B' date='14 July 2010 - 06:31 PM' timestamp='1279128674' post='451908']

ITV News North East has just played tape recordings of Moat starting from last year.

A mention of them here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...ngland-10641225

[penfold]

name='DB7' date='14 July 2010 - 11:09 PM' timestamp='1279145375' post='452020']

I looked at a YT clip of a guy hit by the shotgun taser - and unsurprisingly his hand clenches when hit.

Indeed, but there is some doubt as to whether the electrodes penetrated Moat's multiple leayers of clothing; we'll have to wait for the inquest to find out, I expect.

[frame69]

name='batman' date='10 July 2010 - 01:55 PM' timestamp='1278766534' post='449849']

I disagree. I closed the book on a huge tragedy in my life a few years ago. You're right when you say it doesn't go away, but the book is no longer open, it is on my library shelf. I hope I never have to re-open it.

I know where your coming from,this Sunday is a tricky one for me.

Regards,Frame.

This man was a true coward in every sense...too scared to do his time.

[batman]

name='frame69' date='15 July 2010 - 09:55 AM' timestamp='1279184132' post='452093']

I know where your coming from,this Sunday is a tricky one for me.

My 'tricky one' is coming up in a few weeks ... I hope you get through yours OK.

[frame69]

Thanks. Last Sunday was her birthday but this Sunday coming is the anniversary of her death.When it lands on Sundays it tends to hit me a bit more.

Frame.

[Onedin]

Just found this article on Yahoo.





My link

[Matron Whippy]

Well how much has this cost the tax payer?? or if it went ro trial how much would it cost?? My thoughts do go out to the famlies. \All I will say is one less for the prison?!!