Mayor of London

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by Mark O I didn't know that Railway's were quite that old!

A lot of them used railway tracks that were built for pre-steam railways where carriages were pulled along tracks by horses.

Steve

[CaptainWaggett]

One thing I wil say for Boris - the weather has improved immensely under his regime

[Moor Larkin]

Originally Posted by Moor Larkin I have the definite memory that some old chap was in charge of the Labour group and everyone said he would turfed out once the voters voted, reassured by the aged patrician, and Ken got a grip of things.... and the old guy was..... and Ken took charge.

Disloyalty and treachery became the hallmarks of Livingstone and his circle. He undermined Reg Goodwin, his party's London leader in the 1970s, and declared that the left's job was “to leave Thatcher but get Callaghan first”. Whether he was a communist or a Trotskyite was immaterial (Kinnock called him merely a “Kennist”), but to this day he has kept around him a tight-knit Marxist cabal from a group called Socialist Action (now getting six-figure salaries from London's taxpayers). Livingstone's first putsch was against Andrew McIintosh, the leader of the newly elected Labour GLC (Greater London Council) in 1981. The butchery was done within hours of the election by manoeuvres that would have made Robert Mugabe blush. The hapless deputy leader, Illtyd Harrington, was jeered as a “miserable old git” and told he could stay on if he became “the acceptable face of [Livingstone's] extremism”.
Ken: The Ups and Downs of Ken Livingstone by Andrew Hosken review | Non-fiction book reviews - Times Online

Ah, the memories...............

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by Moor Larkin Disloyalty and treachery became the hallmarks of Livingstone and his circle. He undermined Reg Goodwin, his party's London leader in the 1970s, and declared that the left's job was “to leave Thatcher but get Callaghan first”. Whether he was a communist or a Trotskyite was immaterial (Kinnock called him merely a “Kennist”), but to this day he has kept around him a tight-knit Marxist cabal from a group called Socialist Action (now getting six-figure salaries from London's taxpayers). Livingstone's first putsch was against Andrew McIintosh, the leader of the newly elected Labour GLC (Greater London Council) in 1981. The butchery was done within hours of the election by manoeuvres that would have made Robert Mugabe blush. The hapless deputy leader, Illtyd Harrington, was jeered as a “miserable old git” and told he could stay on if he became “the acceptable face of [Livingstone's] extremism”. Ken: The Ups and Downs of Ken Livingstone by Andrew Hosken review | Non-fiction book reviews - Times Online Ah, the memories...............

You missed the parts that said...
Had it not been for the total decay of British civic democracy in the 1960s and 1970s, Livingstone would have been a footnote in the comical-tragical history of London's loony left. Instead, thanks to Margaret Thatcher and then Tony Blair, he was elected to public office not once but twice on the most sweeping franchise in Britain.
...
It was the nadir of British politics. Labour nationally was appalled, and would have rid itself of Livingstone had Thatcher not rescued him by abolishing the GLC. He became overnight a defender of London democracy and champion anti-Thatcherite. “We turned a left-wing nut into a folk hero,” admitted Patrick Jenkin, the Tory environment minister. The GLC duly abandoned any pretence of civic responsibility, and taxed and spent until its death in 1986. It blew £50m alone on publicity attacking Thatcher.


We get the politicians we deserve, those that know how to play the game and work the system

Steve

[Moor Larkin]

Originally Posted by Steve Crook You missed the parts that said...

Bearing in mind I was replying to myself, I didn't want to make the post any longer................

It sounds like a fun read, I'd buy the book except I feel I know the story already....

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by Moor Larkin I didn't want to make the post any longer................ It sounds like a fun read, I'd buy the book except I feel I know the story already....

I think most of us do know the story. Despite the review quoting Kinnock saying "the only people who like Livingstone are those who don't know him"
I don't think any of these "revelations" have surprised anyone.
Except maybe the journalists

Steve

[Cooper S]

Originally Posted by Third Man Recently I've met two people who where fined £50 for encroaching the inner zone of London without knowing, then sent a letter by the bailiffs and then told they would have to pay £400.

I've only driven into London twice on a weekday since the Checkpoint Charlie Charge was introduced, but I can see how easy it might be for someone to enter the zone without meaning to - London can be pretty distracting, and one wrong decision could put you in the wrong lane without a chance to turn back. I always felt there should be some kind of three strikes before a fine to soften the effect of the system for the unwary or confused.

Sorry to hear that you had to give up your Triumph Christoph404 - you just don't see as many interesting classics around London as you used to. And I did feel that Ken's - possibly now to be unfilled - plan to charge classics over 3 litres the top £25 charge without giving older smaller cars an exemption was unfair. But that's may be because I drive a '93 Mini !

As regards trams - London of course used to have a fantastic tram network which seemed to work pretty well (How would Genevieve have beaten the Spyker without it !). But obviously it was seen as too costly, or old fashioned or something. I still try to catch a Routemaster whenever I can, and ceratinly would be glad to see the back of the bendy buses - rather than the interminable side !

[julian_craster]

Boris learns to use the computer......Can you help him ?

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by Cooper S I've only driven into London twice on a weekday since the Checkpoint Charlie Charge was introduced, but I can see how easy it might be for someone to enter the zone without meaning to - London can be pretty distracting, and one wrong decision could put you in the wrong lane without a chance to turn back. I always felt there should be some kind of three strikes before a fine to soften the effect of the system for the unwary or confused.

All these people getting distracted as they drive around London. So distracted that they don't know which lane they're in or where they're going. It sounds quite dangerous to me. Maybe we should introduce another stage to the driving test which you have to pass before you're allowed to drive in London

Steve

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by julian_craster Boris learns to use the computer......Can you help him ?

Do you mean "can I help him use the computer" or "can I help him" generally?
I think he's been beyond help for some time

Steve

[christoph404]

Originally Posted by Steve Crook All these people getting distracted as they drive around London. So distracted that they don't know which lane they're in or where they're going. It sounds quite dangerous to me. Maybe we should introduce another stage to the driving test which you have to pass before you're allowed to drive in London Steve

Just watch the chariot race in "Ben Hur" a few times, that should prepare you for driving in London

[Cooper S]

Originally Posted by Steve Crook Maybe we should introduce another stage to the driving test which you have to pass before you're allowed to drive in London Steve

Might not be such a bad idea. If you've lived in London all your life it's one thing, but if you're from beyond the M25 it's a bit like entering a gladiatorial arena.

[penfold]

Originally Posted by Cooper S Might not be such a bad idea. If you've lived in London all your life it's one thing, but if you're from beyond the M25 it's a bit like entering a gladiatorial arena.

You should try Bristol....

[Steve Crook]

Originally Posted by christoph404 Just watch the chariot race in "Ben Hur" a few times, that should prepare you for driving in London

Originally Posted by Cooper S Might not be such a bad idea. If you've lived in London all your life it's one thing, but if you're from beyond the M25 it's a bit like entering a gladiatorial arena.

Exactly. Great fun, as long as you know what you're doing and where you're going

It is the occasional visitors that cause the most chaos because they dither at every junction while they read all the road signs and consult their maps.

I don't blame them (too much) but it'd be better if they pulled over to consult their map and prepare themselves for the next section.

Originally Posted by penfold You should try Bristol....

Been there, done that. Piece of cake

I was once staying with friends who lived NE of Birmingham and one morning we wanted to go to visit somewhere SW of Birmingham and so decided to go through the middle of Birmingham - in the rush hour. They knew the way. I'd rarely driven in Birmingham before and certainly not in the rush hour.

When we got to the other end they got out of their car and looked at the back of their car and then at the front of mine. When I asked why, he said he was looking for the tow-rope that I must have used to stick so closely to him through that chaos. I told him, when you're used to driving in London you can drive well in any city in the UK and most cities in the world. Although roundabouts are a bit confusing when they drive on the right


But one unusual thing about London traffic when compared to traffic in most other countries is that you rarely hear people honking their horn. In fact they're really fairly quiet and peaceful. There's no point in getting angry or upset, it won't get you there any faster. You'll be held up again a short way down the road.

I always remember the time I was driving round one of the London squares. As the traffic came off the square there were three lanes that funnelled down into one. So everybody was gently nudging forwards whenever there was room. There was a taxi to my left with a big fellow driving it. He nudged forwards, I nudged forwards. I would down my left hand window. He wound down his window and looked to be ready for a fight. I said "I'll let you go first if you say 'Please' "
He said "Please" and I let him go first and we both went on our way with a smile on our face

Steve

[Cooper S]

Originally Posted by penfold You should try Bristol....

Too right ! I lived there for quite a while - may be that's why I find London a doddle compared to other people I know. Bristol has some of the dodgiest drivers and worst traffic management in the country. The redesign of the centre is a complete disaster. Just visiting for a day is enough to drive you round the bend - literally and metaphorically !