BristolUK

I agree that the best individuals don't necessarily make the best team. The last two performances show that.

But you cannot argue that pairings of Lampard/Gerrard and Rooney/Owen don't work when the results and team performances say otherwise.

Someone on another forum showed Rooney and Owen have played 15 times together. Of those games, England Won 12, drew 1 and lost two. The bulk of these games were at Euro 2004 and competitive qualifiers for WC06.

Lampard and Gerrard played as a pair for most of those games as well.

If the pairings were so negative that four players were misfiring the results (and performances) would not have been good. It would have been impossible to have played well with such a hindrance. The other seven wouldn't be able to cope with their own performances AND make up for those problems. It just cannot be done at this level.


I will agree that L&G don't normally work. It's only when Rooney and Owen have both been in the same team that the pairing did work. It may well be that another pairing may have done better...but at Euro 2004 they both contributed the goals that gave the results. Other midfield pairings haven't done that.

BristolUK

Um..... SWP is an exciting player to watch...but not a single attempted ball into the penalty area got past the first man.

David Brent

England also have the exciting prospect of having players like Ashley Young and Aaron Lennon available who can both use the wings to great effect.

I think it is only a matter of time before Young is elevated to the main England squad. He has been in great form.

Dave.

Fareham_Bee

And how many of Beckham's do? Not as many as they have you believe. England looked far more dangerous without him than with. Stick with what they have on the right.
At least with Wright Phillips they are creating chances by his continual running at defenders causing some panic in the defence and I can't remember for fact but am certain he did get a percentage in. We'll have to beg to differ and I'll watch more carefully next time for that. Promise

batman

Oh dear ... another dismal performance from Chelski. At least the England boys 'n' girls are giving me something to cheer about!

Bats.

"Boom boom a baby .... Banham Zoo .... Banana pants! Hahahaha"

knobbykins

The mighty and truly magnificent Southampton had their best saturday in ages.........we play tomorrow!

When the king's off his arse nobody sleeps!

DB7

Bad day for Liverpool too as Rafa rested a few; no doubt with an eye on the midweek CL.

batman

That does pee me off. Oh for the days when the league title was the most important thing.

Bats.

"Boom boom a baby .... Banham Zoo .... Banana pants! Hahahaha"

BristolUK

Other footie forums are full of people wanting Beckham left out and SWP or any number of others in. But the anti Beckham posters have all commented on SWP's TOTAL failure to beat the first man with ANY cross. The nearest he got was one deflected as opposed to blocked. I was paying attention from when I noticed it in the Israel game.

I hope SWP succeeds. I really do. He excites me more than the other choices. But the chances we created in these two games were more down to a better midfield balance and Owen having someone he can work with.

I don't need to argue for Beckham. The fact that he virtually guarantees at least one goal (assist or scoring) when he plays - even if way below his best - does that for me.

Too many people get caught up the media hype surrounding him and consequently fail to see he's at least effective. If he's still in the squad, maybe he can show how to cross the ball properly.

But yes, we can agree to differ.

Fareham_Bee

Yeah, think we are going to. It's the media hype that people follow to stick up for him.
He has failed to produce the goods time and time again, and not performed well at any major finals. Always tells us "wasn't reallyfir last time, this time I'm really up for it and will win it" then hides when going gets tough, At times England needed a captain like Zidane that would take a game by the scruff of the neck when needed to, to go looking for the ball and taking the game on, he just used to disappear.
Let's not forget one of Germany's goals was caused by him bottling a challenge from a clearance, Germany got ball and went and scored. Same as Brazil game in Japan.
At the moment, England look far more dangerous without him, without Lampard, and I like Lampard so let's make them wait and fight for their places.

More importantly Brentford are on the downward slide, being beaten and outplayed by Franchise FC a club that shouldn't even be in the league, a club everyone should hammer! I'm going to sulk in a dark room.

orpheum

Jol will be in on the dole.Anyway saw Brazil v China in Womens World Cup.Brazil won 4-0 due to defensive lapses.Is it appropriate to say tha they were due to "schoolboy errors"?

Welcome To Highbury The Home Of Football

Harbottle

Fifth away win of the season thanks to a 3-2 at Oxford United, the Shots are on fire under the rather excellent Garry Waddock (I had no doubts honest )

batman

Very good .

Let's hope the Argentines play like a bunch of 'schoolboys' tomorrow!

Bats.

"Boom boom a baby .... Banham Zoo .... Banana pants! Hahahaha"

BristolUK

Sure he's disappointed us all - although, as with Stuart Pearce's exorcising his 1990 ghosts in 1996, I think Beckham did the same in 02 against Argentina after what happened in 1998.

But that's what really gets me angry. Beckham is singled out for failing to do the same things almost everyone else in the England squads have failed to do. That's just wrong when he's given so much. Remember he was literally throwing up but still doing his best for the team...and everyone (except maybe Joe Cole) was awful at WC06. But despite being poor (by his standards) he still accounted for over half of our goals. Without that contribution we wouldn't have got through the group stage.

I remember him pulling out of that tackle against Brazil. We can be cynical about fitness. But it's a fact he broke his foot just weeks before WC02. It was a miracle he was as fit as he was. The tackle was on half way; not usually a dangerous position. Imagine the stick he'd have got, making a tackle that far away from goal and damaging the foot again.

Fareham_Bee

Simple answer is he shouldn't have been there then! If you aren't fit you shouldn't be playing because you become a liability. As he did. He bottled that challenge full stop, no excuses. I can't imagine him having time to think, "if I make this challenge I'll be slaughtered for breaking my foot out here!" No he bottled it.
The reason he is picked out by those of us able to see through the myth is because he can do no wrong even when he does.

Hopefully our discussion is academic anyway. England at last look dangerous and force to be reckoned with, Funnily enough, without him.